being a Beethoven enthusiest

[lysander]

Originally posted by Steppenwolf:
What would you classify as garbage? Give some examples.

If you are refering to 20th century classical music, I would agree with you.

Especially Leos Janacek, and William Walton. Insufferable!!!
Their music represents the age we are living in -- ((( Demented!)))




[This message has been edited by lysander (edited March 26, 2003).]

[Sorrano]

Originally posted by Joy:
Don't even try to convert your friends, it's a waste of time. My friends will listen to classical when I have it on but they also will put on something else once my CD gets finished. Luckily my parents were into classical music when I was very young so I grew up with it. They did not listen to Beethoven though. I discovered him on my own. My Mother liked opera mostly Puccini and all that, also she played the piano which really got me interested in music listening to her play all kinds of music. My Mother's side of the family was very musical.

Joy

[This message has been edited by Joy (edited March 25, 2003).]

For me, the conversion process had more to do with my own mother playing Mozart sonatas on the piano while she waited for the laundry to get done. I had more exposure to the popular tunes of the 60's via my brothers, but that never commanded that much interest. I did not dislike the music but I simply gravitated to that which was more meaningful to me; Mozart. Beethoven was introduced to me in school at an early age. For years that introduction festered within my subconciousness, then suddenly it awakened with great passion which has not let up since.

[Sorrano]

Originally posted by Steppenwolf:

Why don't more people like it? Hmm ... there are a few reasons. One - society in general, nowadays, is culturally decadent. Western art and culture is going down the drainpipe, and "high" modern art is even more horrible than the nasty types of pop art.
People are also less well educated these days. Look at an average letter written by an average person 100 years ago, compared to an email or letter written by someone today, to see what a difference there is.
Classical music requires an initiation.

[This message has been edited by Steppenwolf (edited March 26, 2003).]

I think that the key to this is people are too lazy. In emails and especially in online gaming there are very few people if any who even care to form complete sentences, let alone use punctuation. This generation seeks the easy road with all the short cuts. What a pity!

[Steppenwolf]

Originally posted by Sorrano:

I think that the key to this is people are too lazy. In emails and especially in online gaming there are very few people if any who even care to form complete sentences, let alone use punctuation. This generation seeks the easy road with all the short cuts. What a pity!

That is true, but it's not the whole picture. People are, generally, less well educated, especially those unfortunate enough to have to endure sub-standard state education.
There is a practical test. Who now, under the age of 40, can recite poety?

[heidi]

Originally posted by lysander:
Especially Leos Janacek, and William Walton. Insufferable!!!
Their music represents the age we are living in -- ((( Demented!)))


[This message has been edited by lysander (edited March 26, 2003).]

Thank you for all feedback, and I'm sorry I brought up the Beatles. I am not a fan but will listen to that age of music. If I have to listen to something else besides my classical.

I so agree with lysander on 'demented' music. I work around young(er) people and the things I hear are pathetic. But it isn't just younger kids that like it. As an example (if you don't mind a short story). My oldest sister, in her late 40's, came to visit a few weeks ago. We headed out to lunch in her car and she had Eminem playing. I said "Is this your kids?" and she said "No, I love this guy. Don't you?"
I'm very conservative and tactful, but this music is rediculous. Can you believe he won an Oscar for his music. If that is the height of music in this culture today, I'm ashamed and I can't understand, but then again I like classical music.

I am very blessed that my own two daughters, 9 and 12, will not listen to pop music. They like christian contemporay, and I did not influence that. Their father and friends have. Hopefully my influence with great music will affect them later in life.

[Peter]

Originally posted by Rod:

I was thinking primarily of the vast majority of music composed after Beethoven's time as garbage. In this respect there is a complete logic to my position.

I simply cannot agree - bad music was written before and after Beethoven, but I would not include composers such as Chopin, Brahms, Schumann (to name just a few) in the garbage category, that is simply ridiculous.

------------------
'Man know thyself'

[Stargazer]

Originally posted by Peter:
I simply cannot agree - bad music was written before and after Beethoven, but I would not include composers such as Chopin, Brahms, Schumann (to name just a few) in the garbage category, that is simply ridiculous.

I concur, i myself feel the more drawn to Bartok music at every listen.

His String Quartets are among the best i ever heard, possibly THE very best besides Beethoven's, a notch over for sheer technical ity and mathematical genious.

True, Bartok music is dark and macabre, truly reflecting the hungarian spirit in the face of one of the most brutal wars in human hystory, but the efford is there, different, but equally compelling.

People should learn they cannot hold their own personal taste as a standard to which everything must be compared.

What does it even mean music after Beethoven era is all crap ?!? Were people then different then they are now ?!? Did god descended upon heart and decided to make all people smarter from 1700 to 1900 and then everybody becomes an idiot again ?!?

Not likely. The potential is there. With each generation there is a chance for genious to rise and flourish. It could be from an unexpected direction, and you might not like it, but it's there nonetheless.

Music started to suffer only when it stopped being considered an art form, leaving no chance for new talents to grow and develop...

[Peter]

Originally posted by Stargazer:
Did god descended upon heart and decided to make all people smarter from 1700 to 1900 and then everybody becomes an idiot again ?!?

Not likely. The potential is there. With each generation there is a chance for genious to rise and flourish. It could be from an unexpected direction, and you might not like it, but it's there nonetheless.

Music started to suffer only when it stopped being considered an art form, leaving no chance for new talents to grow and develop...

There is no doubt that certain eras were the zenith of artistic achievement and that there is not always a continual progress but spontaneous outbursts. The 5th century BC was the greatest period of Greek art - the Italian renaissance triggered a new flowering.

------------------
'Man know thyself'

[Stargazer]

Originally posted by Peter:

There is no doubt that certain eras were the zenith of artistic achievement and that there is not always a continual progress but spontaneous outbursts. The 5th century BC was the greatest period of Greek art - the Italian renaissance triggered a new flowering.

All i'm saying is that human potential is the same with each generation, you just can't look at the same direction forever.

Society is ever changing and new artist will never be able to understand what inspired Beethoven, and any attempt to emulate those works will result in mediocre productions.

In the meantime, new young individuals will be inspired in a different way, setting the charge for the next artistical boom...