Hammerklavier

[Albert Gans]

Hi all !

I was trying to find the date of the first (public) performance of the Hammerklavier, but so far only have found the following:
The work was created between 1817-1819 (on this website, the dates are different). First performance seems to be unknown. First known performance(s) I found was by Carl Czerny in 1823/1824 (also rather vague) and/or Liszt (who was about 10 year old at the time and a pupil of Czerny) in 1821 or 1822.....

Does anyone know more?

Season's greetings to all Beethoven lovers (and the unfortunate others)

Albert

[Peter]

I was wondering if the performances given by Czerny and Liszt were complete or just single movements? Beethoven was well aware of the difficulties this sonata posed for the pianist and listeners and even went as far as to suggest to Ries that the 4th movement could be left out altogether in order to make the work more accessible for a London audience. At a later date, Liszt performed just the adagio to an overwhelmed Wagner!

[Megan]

This link suggests that the first public performance was given by Liszt in 1836.

http://discplus.ch/index.asp?from=xy...memreloaded=10

[AeolianHarp]

Yes, I always thought it was performed first by Liszt also. Isn't it strange to think that practically nobody heard Hammerklavier in Beethoven's time?

[Peter]

Yes, I always thought it was performed first by Liszt also. Isn't it strange to think that practically nobody heard Hammerklavier in Beethoven's time?

Not just Op.106, works such as the violin concerto were rarely performed in Beethoven's lifetime.

[Albert Gans]

Interesting responses, although no definite answers. The one mentioning Liszt in 1836 doesn't give a source where that came from.
Nor do mine... I have no idea, Peter, whether or not the Czerny or Liszt (early) performances were partial or complete.

Another riddle to be added... keeps us all on our toes, our beloved B.

[AeolianHarp]

Not just Op.106, works such as the violin concerto were rarely performed in Beethoven's lifetime.

Yes, I knew quite a few were not. But then he seemed to know that future generations, i.e- us would get to see and hear his music....

[Albert Gans]

Going to a performance of the Violin Concerto and the 5th tomorrow:
http://www.koelner-philharmonie.de/v...altung/116072/

[AeolianHarp]

Going to a performance of the Violin Concerto and the 5th tomorrow:
http://www.koelner-philharmonie.de/v...altung/116072/

I hope you had a great time Albert!

[PaulD]

By the time you read this post, you will have returned from the concert. I hope you enjoyed it and that hearing these legendary compositions live was a moving experience.

I went to listen to the 5th about 25 yrs ago in Toronto. The work was combined with the 2nd piano concerto by Shostakovich which went first. The hall was almost full for the concerto but after the intermission, to my dismay, a noticeable number of spectators left as if hearing the 5th an nth time was not worth it. To this day, I remember this bizarre event.

Hopefully this did not happen at your concert!

[Fidelio]

John M. Gingerich states in his ‘Schubert's Beethoven Project’ that Liszt gave the first public performance of Op. 106 in Paris in 1836 and in early 1837 Moscheles in London. This is confirmed by Kenneth Hamilton in 'Liszt: Sonata in B Minor'.

Berlioz writing in the Gazette musicale (12 June 1836), discussed Liszt’s reappearance in glowing terms. At the close of the article, he singled out Liszt’s performance of the Op.106 (its first known public performance in Paris) for special praise.

[Albert Gans]

Thanks for all your responses.

And the concert was simply spectacular. Patricia Kopatchisnkaia performed, a wonderful violinist, with a mind of her own, which makes for quite a show. She played cadenzas of her own (I'm fairly sure, never heard them and they were at times in places there is no cadenza given), cadenzas that even involved other players in the orchestra, forming duets or even quartets and conversing with the timpani !!!! The whole hall (Philharmonie, Köln) was mesmerized. I would have thought Beethoven either would have exploded for the liberties she and Currentzis/MusicAeterna Orchestra took, or else would have been overwhelmed because he was such a great improviser himself.

The 5th (my favourite symphony, by the way) was also performed at a level I've seldom seen.

An unforgettable experience, if you have a chance to see Kopatchisnkaia, besides Alina Kopostkina, it is a must....

[AeolianHarp]

Sounds great Albert!