Piano quartett Woo36 from 1785 !

[gprengel]

Today I listened again to one of the most neglected gems by Beethoven - the piano quartett woo36 from an age of 15 !!!!! It was composed even before Mozart composed his great piano quartetts KV 479 and 493!!!

Especially the Allegro con spirito is breathtaking (at 6:55) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Et9SugHVc

I can't believe that Beethoven himself disregarded this work and didn't publish it with a opus number. For me it its Beethoven's best work of his time till the Pathetique (well, together with an Aria from the King Joseph cantata)

Gerd

[AeolianHarp]

Today I listened again to one of the most neglected gems by Beethoven - the piano quartett woo36 from an age of 15 !!!!! It was composed even before Mozart composed his great piano quartetts KV 479 and 493!!!

Especially the Allegro con spirito is breathtaking (at 6:55) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Et9SugHVc

I can't believe that Beethoven himself disregarded this work and didn't publish it with a opus number. For me it its Beethoven's best work of his time till the Pathetique (well, together with an Aria from the King Joseph cantata)

Gerd

I know this brilliant Quartet well Gerd. It just shows that the often stated myth that Beethoven was a "late starter" compared with Mozart is just not true!!! This is a brilliant, mature work.

[Michael]

Today I listened again to one of the most neglected gems by Beethoven - the piano quartett woo36 from an age of 15 !!!!! It was composed even before Mozart composed his great piano quartetts KV 479 and 493!!!

Especially the Allegro con spirito is breathtaking (at 6:55) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Et9SugHVc


Gerd

Have a listen to the opening of this and hear where the young Beethoven committed minor larceny:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWsJgmPBEyU

(The WoO36 pieces are wonderful, though!)

[AeolianHarp]

It's a tribute/homage Michael, and what about Brahms "nicking" some of the Ninth in one of his works?

It's just a few bars- the rest of the Quartet is pure Beethoven!

[Decrepit Poster]

I don't disagree with the above assessments. However, as enjoyable as the piece is to listen to -- I especially like the fast second movement -- I can see Beethoven's reluctance to include it as part of the official canon. Not for lack of technical prowess. Rather, while listening to the two bookend movements little jumps out at me and announces in bold letters B E E T H O V E N! Even the second movement is somewhat conventional in nature. Listening to the Piano Trio Op.1. No.1, Beethoven announces himself from the beginning. Its opening and closing movements are hard to confuse with anyone else. Only its second movement is, in my opinion, somewhat conventional. Likewise the first piano sonata, Op.2 No.1, is pure Beethoven for much of its duration. Early Beethoven to be sure, but Beethoven none the less.

Again, don't take this as a knock against the quartet, which I like well enough. But I can see where Beethoven is coming from.

ADDENDUM: I think what I'm trying to say in my bumbling way is that with the quartet Beethoven might not have felt he had found his true "voice".

[AeolianHarp]

Well, I dunno..I have listened to it many a time and forgot he was 15 when it was composed! It is that good.

Can you imagine a 15 year old today composing something of this quality? Er no.

[Michael]

It's a tribute/homage Michael, and what about Brahms "nicking" some of the Ninth in one of his works?

It's just a few bars- the rest of the Quartet is pure Beethoven!

Of course! Even Mozart "nicked" material when it suited him. Schubert also borrowed a theme from the Ninth in his own Ninth. And Handel stole right, left and centre (mostly from himself.)

Beethoven's piano quartets are among my favourite works, and B himself thought well enough of them to recycle a couple of their themes, a few years later, in his Opus 2 piano sonatas. (Stealing from himself. )

[Quijote]

Well, I suppose with only 12 (chromatic) notes available on paper (and keyboard), a lot of repetition is inevitable.

[dahc]

Thanks so much for directing me to these fine Piano trios WoO 36.
No 1 In E flat is beautiful and my favorite of the three. Of course I am partial to the Master in the key E flat.
One can see a young composer ripe to experiment with the form. I was surprised by ending chord of the Allegro moderato Mvt of No 2 in D as well as the few measures of pizzicato in the Andante con moto Mvt.
But what really got my attention was the five measures in the first Mvt of No 3 in C major, Allegro vivace, that appears also in Piano sonata Op 2 no 3 and the Adagio con expressione which theme is used in piano sonata Op 2 No 1
Yes, I wonder what LvB thought of these pieces we now see as gems

[AeolianHarp]

All his piano trios are brilliant. I'm listening to the Archduke Trio right now.

It is musical perfection.

[gprengel]

All his piano trios are brilliant. I'm listening to the Archduke Trio right now.

It is musical perfection.

then you may also like to listen to another Trio movement which he composed right after the Archduke Trio in 1811 - a most lovely movement which is very much unknown!!! Do you know that work?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clwiwffkCac

[AeolianHarp]

then you may also like to listen to another Trio movement which he composed right after the Archduke Trio in 1811 - a most lovely movement which is very much unknown!!! Do you know that work?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clwiwffkCac

Vielen Dank Gerd! Nein, ich nicht kennen es bis gerade.

Schön!

( Many mistakes I know.... but I am trying!)