What are you listening to now?

[Roehre]

Beethoven, a disc called Works for Chorus and Orchestra, on Koch. I believe I was talking about this disc with Roehre a while back, as it includes the 1822 version of Opferlied.

Meeresstille und gluckliche Fahrt, Op. 112
Opferlied, Op. 121b (1822 version)
Opferlied, Op. 121b (1824 version)
Bundeslied, Op. 122
"Wo sich die Pulse jugendlich jagen" from "Die Weihe des Hauses", WoO 98
Incidental music for "Leonore Prohaska", WoO 96
Triumphal March for "Tarpeja", WoO 2a
March for Military Band, WoO 18
March for Military Band, WoO 19

That's the one, Chris.

[Chris]

That's the one, Chris.

Yes. Unfortunately, I am more confused about the history of this piece than ever now. I think I will make a new thread on it.

[Roehre]

Today:

Stenhammar:
Symphony no.1 in F (1903)
Symphony no.2 in g op.34 (1915)
(with a nice passage in the 1st mvt foreshadowing Moeran’s Symphony of 20 years later)

Leighton:
Symphony no.2 op.69 “Sinfonia mistica” (1973/’74)

[Preston]

the end by the doors

[Roehre]

Today:

Stenhammar:
Piano concerto no.1 in b-flat minor op.1 (1894)
Piano concerto no.2 in d op. 23 (1907)

Binchois:
Domitor Hectoris
3 Mass movements
Nove Cantum melodie

TTFN, I’ll be back January 20th

[Peter]

Trying to improve my French with Michel Thomas!

[Preston]

Listening to something of a first experience with Bruckner and his Symphony No. 3... 1) I am blown away, 2) while at the same time upset because I am not hearing it properly and I know it!

After listening to Dvorak's symphonies, Bruckner Symphony 3 makes all of Dvorak's symphonies seem like a child attempting to play chopsticks but cannot because he lacks understanding of feeling? Does that make sense to any of you Brucknerians?

Thoughts that have crossed my mind while listening are:

- EPIC
- deep and powerful moments, yet, sudden stops of beauty and piece
- flowing diversity
- concerning the instrumentation - so much more space, to my ears, than anything classical or baroque (which is one the problems I have - the classical and baroque eras sound so fast and tight (tight in a sense) and all tiny or something? Either I am completely missing the point with the Baroque era or the orchestra is playing it wrong? Probably the former, though I can't imagine that being the case, at least wholly. It is like Mozart's music is so jacked up some, well a lot it seems?, time, as if he were on crack or something... wait, that's kind-of it a good word - jacked? I don't know. Anyway.

I think Bruckner is thoughts about how music should be written are far better than a lot of other composers - I refuse to say Beethoven (whose music is hard for me to get) because I think Beethoven - well anyway...

Now I am hearing a lot of, but as mentioned it is very diverse, almost epic (I don't think epic is the right word, but it is very dramatic, loose, open, free, etc.) sound, lots of space between the instruments, drastic changes, etc. I don't know?

The problem I am having is understanding what he is saying - what I mean is - I cannot pick up on the feelings as well as I need to, such as, the melodies, harmony, etc. I want to hear the melodic content!!! hehe. I the melodic material better with Dvorak - but I can't imagine one note of Dvorak being as moving as what I am hearing - and that is not even much feeling, only the things I described above, with Bruckner's 3rd. Symphony.

Anyway, as some may see I'm a little shocked. Any help from you Brucknerians would be nice.

[Sorrano]

When I listen to Bruckner I think of landscapes. There are majestic towering mountains in the background, then suddenly I stop and see a gorgeous flower and examine the petals in detail, then again the mountains loom ahead; clouds cross the sun, casting shadows upon the whole vista....etc. (Which version of the 3rd Symphony are you listening to? There are three versions, but that is not as important to you at this time.

Sometimes Bruckner is not easy to listen to; the music goes it's own direction and does not have a similar urgency as in the Beethoven 3rd or 5th Symphony. It's more like a vast panorama of emotion and beauty.

I don't know if that helps at all, but those are some thoughts.

[Peter]

The problem I am having is understanding what he is saying - what I mean is - I cannot pick up on the feelings as well as I need to, such as, the melodies, harmony, etc. I want to hear the melodic content!!! hehe. I the melodic material better with Dvorak - but I can't imagine one note of Dvorak being as moving as what I am hearing - and that is not even much feeling, only the things I described above, with Bruckner's 3rd. Symphony.

Anyway, as some may see I'm a little shocked. Any help from you Brucknerians would be nice.

Bruckner I think of in terms of massive structures like a cathedral - it takes a lot of listening to in order to appreciate properly so don't be too hard on yourself - you are at least responding. I'd try the slow movements of the 7th and 8th symphonies next! Regarding Dvorak try his 'cello concerto (particularly the slow movement).

[Preston]

When I listen to Bruckner I think of landscapes. There are majestic towering mountains in the background, then suddenly I stop and see a gorgeous flower and examine the petals in detail, then again the mountains loom ahead; clouds cross the sun, casting shadows upon the whole vista....etc. (Which version of the 3rd Symphony are you listening to? There are three versions, but that is not as important to you at this time.

Sometimes Bruckner is not easy to listen to; the music goes it's own direction and does not have a similar urgency as in the Beethoven 3rd or 5th Symphony. It's more like a vast panorama of emotion and beauty.

I don't know if that helps at all, but those are some thoughts.

Yes Sorrano that does help - about the landscapes, mountains, beauty, etc. - because I hear something that could be that, and what you wrote is quite moving to be honest with you, !

The first time I heard it was the 1877, I think that is what the host on Sirius radio said? I downloaded the one from 1887 though. Any monumental differences?

It's more like a vast panorama of emotion and beauty.

Beautiful Sorrano.


A side thought, I think an interesting experiment would to take a work of say Vivaldi, such as one of his minor concertos, and perform it in the style of Bruckner - as in as true of the sense as it could be. I think that would be an interesting experiment, though, someone would have to do it RIGHT!

[Preston]

Bruckner I think of in terms of massive structures like a cathedral - it takes a lot of listening to in order to appreciate properly so don't be too hard on yourself - you are at least responding. I'd try the slow movements of the 7th and 8th symphonies next! Regarding Dvorak try his 'cello concerto (particularly the slow movement).

You are actually very correct Peter - about responding, and, now that I've listened to it a few more times I have started to hear more melodic (which is anything but a catchy phrase, if you will) content - and it is deep and powerful, etc. That opening, it builds up and then unleashes, then the brass comes in so powerfully, etc.

Thank you Bruckner.

[Sorrano]

The first time I heard it was the 1877, I think that is what the host on Sirius radio said? I downloaded the one from 1887 though. Any monumental differences?

A side thought, I think an interesting experiment would to take a work of say Vivaldi, such as one of his minor concertos, and perform it in the style of Bruckner - as in as true of the sense as it could be. I think that would be an interesting experiment, though, someone would have to do it RIGHT!

The Symphony was completed in 1873 but the original was not performed until 1978. The first movement of the original is significantly longer than the revised versions and with it there is a greater sense of balance and meaning to the movement. For example, at nearly the very center of the movement is a triple forte statement of the opening theme, placed their strategically. The subsequent versions retain that same passage, but it appears more towards the end of the work which, in my opinion, cripples the sense of balance. Robert Simpson, who studied and wrote extensively regarding the symphonies was highly critical of the 3rd Symphony, but after hearing the original version softened his attitude significantly. The movement is very long, but if you have the patience for it, it is very powerful and moving.

[Chris]

Haydn - The Seasons (English) - The Fairfield County Chorale/AmorArtis Classical Orchestra/Johannes Somary

A good recording, but it uses a newer English translation by Alice Parker and Thomas Pyle. Which is "better", but somehow I feel like it's better to just leave these things as they originally were. This is literally the only English version of The Seasons I could find on period instruments.

[Peter]

Josquin des Prez - Ave Maria and some chansons.

[Preston]

The Symphony was completed in 1873 but the original was not performed until 1978. The first movement of the original is significantly longer than the revised versions and with it there is a greater sense of balance and meaning to the movement. For example, at nearly the very center of the movement is a triple forte statement of the opening theme, placed their strategically. The subsequent versions retain that same passage, but it appears more towards the end of the work which, in my opinion, cripples the sense of balance. Robert Simpson, who studied and wrote extensively regarding the symphonies was highly critical of the 3rd Symphony, but after hearing the original version softened his attitude significantly. The movement is very long, but if you have the patience for it, it is very powerful and moving.

Sorrano, I made a mistake, I'm not listening to the 1887 version (which I am doubting one exist?) but the 1889 version, conducted by Kurt Sanderling. Sorry about that.

http://www.amazon.com/Bruckner-Symph...63470&sr=301-5