Musical Hoaxes

[Megan]

Musical Tomfoolery with John Cage, or is it?

Apologies to Philip.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLZ7y...eature=related

[Sorrano]

It would be interesting to listen to this without the visual; I think a very different impression might be had. However, I'm not sure that was Cage's intention.

[Preston]

Aren't there pieces written by Mozart and I think even Beethoven called musical jokes? I think I'm right in saying that?

[Chris]

Yes, Mozart and Beethoven both wrote some musical jokes. Funny guys, those two!

[Roehre]

Aren't there pieces written by Mozart and I think even Beethoven called musical jokes? I think I'm right in saying that?

Mozart's Sextet for string quartet and 2 horns KV522 is called the Dorfmusikantensextett (local musicians' sextet) as well as Ein musicalischer Spass (a musical joke), the former pointing at musicians not up to their job, the latter to composers who don't reign supreme in their trade either.

Basically it was something similar which was used by Beethoven in the scherzo of the Pastoral.

Apart from numerous humorous Canons, Beethoven's Duo WoO 32 is called the Augengläserduett (duo for two pair of glasses), though here the composer uses the finer details of composing to make his (humourous) point.

[Preston]

Thanks Chris and Roehre.

the latter to composers who don't reign supreme in their trade either.

Perhaps Mozart being a little too proud of his abilities? Any thoughts?

duo for two pair of glasses

Which brings me to a question I've wondered for a while...

[Megan]

Mozart's Sextet for string quartet and 2 horns KV522 is called the Dorfmusikantensextett (local musicians' sextet) as well as Ein musicalischer Spass (a musical joke), the former pointing at musicians not up to their job, the latter to composers who don't reign supreme in their trade either.

Basically it was something similar which was used by Beethoven in the scherzo of the Pastoral.

Apart from numerous humorous Canons, Beethoven's Duo WoO 32 is called the Augengläserduett (duo for two pair of glasses), though here the composer uses the finer details of composing to make his (humourous) point.

I found the Beethoven , Duo WoO 32, on youtube, this is the first time I have heard it. It is a very nice piece.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjQW3...eature=related

[Hofrat]

I think Beethoven's "The Flea" is absolutely hilarious, especially the ending where the pianist tries to squash the flea with his thumb on the keyboard.

[Wyresider]

Perhaps Mozart being a little too proud of his abilities? Any thoughts?

In a letter to his Dad (from Paris around 1781, I think) he described the Stamitz brothers as "scribblers". Well, neither was a Mozart, but posterity has rated them a bit higher than that.

And after the Clementi piano duel (when he was quite entitled to be annoyed, but it wasn't Clementi's fault) he described Clementi as "a mere mechanicus". Some time later, he said Clementi was "a charlatan, like all Italians". (Actually, that one was being humorous -- his lead-up to it was that Clementi "marked presto but played allegro", so it's maybe not evidence.) But Clementi was a finer musician than Mozart would give him credit for and the long-term effect on his reputation was profound. I'm sure he would be regarded much more highly today if mid-Victorian sensation-seeking writers hadn't built Mozart's fairly minor remarks (and other peoples', often uninformed) into a whole Clementi-bashing fad and destroyed him.

[Hofrat]

I believe that Mozart sent a letter to his father praising the string quartets of Ignatz Pleyel. So, Mozart could compliment a fellow musician rather than being just plain nasty.

[Peter]

In a letter to his Dad (from Paris around 1781, I think) he described the Stamitz brothers as "scribblers". Well, neither was a Mozart, but posterity has rated them a bit higher than that.

And after the Clementi piano duel (when he was quite entitled to be annoyed, but it wasn't Clementi's fault) he described Clementi as "a mere mechanicus". Some time later, he said Clementi was "a charlatan, like all Italians". (Actually, that one was being humorous -- his lead-up to it was that Clementi "marked presto but played allegro", so it's maybe not evidence.) But Clementi was a finer musician than Mozart would give him credit for and the long-term effect on his reputation was profound. I'm sure he would be regarded much more highly today if mid-Victorian sensation-seeking writers hadn't built Mozart's fairly minor remarks (and other peoples', often uninformed) into a whole Clementi-bashing fad and destroyed him.

Beethoven certainly thought very highly of Clementi's sonatas and the evidence for that is not only in his own private collection of Clementi sonatas, but also in the direct influence they had on his own piano music.

[Megan]

..

[Peter]

..

Not sure how to reply to this complex and thought provoking post Megan - give me a few days to do some research!

[Megan]

Not sure how to reply to this complex and thought provoking post Megan - give me a few days to do some research!

Ha ha, don't take too much time mulling it over Peter


Actually, I tried to edit my previous post and somehow ended up with another post. I remembered afterwards that the edit and delete facility can only be done after 24hrs ? Please do delete waste of space. Apologies.

[Peter]

Ha ha, don't take too much time mulling it over Peter


Actually, I tried to edit my previous post and somehow ended up with another post. I remembered afterwards that the edit and delete facility can only be done after 24hrs ? Please do delete waste of space. Apologies.

Not to worry Megan - I realise it was a ditto and you were in obvious agreement with my previous comments! Either that or it was a reference to John Cage?