Inedita Beethoven Rarities series

[Chris]

I have recently become aware of Inedita, a small label that has produced recordings of very rare Beethoven works. They have a series called "Beethoven Rarities." Information on Vols. 2 through 5 is readily available (as well as forthcoming volumes). But oddly enough I can find absolutely nothing about Vol. 1 anywhere. I know some posters here own some of these CDs, so can anyone tell me why information on the first volume seems to be impossible to find or what was on it? It just got me curious.

[Megan]

I have recently become aware of Inedita, a small label that has produced recordings of very rare Beethoven works. They have a series called "Beethoven Rarities." Information on Vols. 2 through 5 is readily available (as well as forthcoming volumes). But oddly enough I can find absolutely nothing about Vol. 1 anywhere. I know some posters here own some of these CDs, so can anyone tell me why information on the first volume seems to be impossible to find or what was on it? It just got me curious.

Chris, perhaps it is best to emal them direct for info.

http://www.ineditacd.com/asp-fr/dett_ldw2.asp

[Hofrat]

Piano concerto in E-flat WoO 4
Romance in E minor Hess 13
Romance in G opus 40
Romance in F opus 50
12 Contredances WoO 14

[Michael]

Piano concerto in E-flat WoO 4
Romance in E minor Hess 13
Romance in G opus 40
Romance in F opus 50
12 Contredances WoO 14

The first two might be classed as rarities but certainly not the rest. The Hess 13 is a completed fragment but it's quite a little gem.

[Chris]

Piano concerto in E-flat WoO 4
Romance in E minor Hess 13
Romance in G opus 40
Romance in F opus 50
12 Contredances WoO 14

Thanks, but that's Volume 2.

And I agree that most of those are not rarities. It would be nice if they didn't fill the discs out with things that are not rare, but they may need to in order to get enough to sell a disc and keep the series going, which is totally understandable.

[Megan]

Inedita specialise in editions of rare works. The first volume of the works of Ludwig van Beethoven include a version of the fragment of the 1st movement - Allegro con brio - of the concerto for violin and orchestra WoO 5, in C major. This work was never completed (1790-1792).

This work has been reconstructed by Robert Diem Tigani. The book explains the choices made by Robert Tigani at the time of his work on the reconstruction.

Also on the CD, the two German Dances, WoO 8, and the Musik zu einem Ritterballet, WoO 1.


A CD of very good quality, strongly recommended.


From Dominique Pervot's Beethoven site.
Bottom of the page.

http://www.lvbeethoven.com/Cedes/TheCds_Violin.html

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[Roehre]

Inedita specialise in editions of rare works. The first volume of the works of Ludwig van Beethoven include a version of the fragment of the 1st movement - Allegro con brio - of the concerto for violin and orchestra WoO 5, in C major. This work was never completed (1790-1792).

This work has been reconstructed by Robert Diem Tigani. The book explains the choices made by Robert Tigani at the time of his work on the reconstruction.

Also on the CD, the two German Dances, WoO 8, and the Musik zu einem Ritterballet, WoO 1.
A CD of very good quality, strongly recommended.


From Dominique Pervot's Beethoven site.
Bottom of the page.

http://www.lvbeethoven.com/Cedes/TheCds_Violin.html

.

Whether the concerto ever was completed or not is an open question. The fact that the score has been completely written out, i.e. including most of the phrasing and the dynamics, and ends at the right hand side of a left (i.e. a verso) page, strongly points to a once complete score, at least one of a first movement.

Sketches suggest that a slow mvt as well as a finale were conceived too.
There is not much to reconstruct or to edit in the surviving score of WoO 5 (e.g. published in an appendix to Schiedermaier's 1926 published Der junge Beethoven); the question is: how to continue this fragment, as the development section is nearly completely missing, as obviously is the coda.

[Chris]

Nice work, Megan, it looks like you found the answer!

[Michael]

There is not much to reconstruct or to edit in the surviving score of WoO 5 ....... the question is: how to continue this fragment, as the development section is nearly completely missing, as obviously is the coda.

This hasn't prevented a number of people from trying to complete this movement. One of the more recent ones, published by Wilifried Fischer in 1972, sticks closest to the original material. The whole piece is very attractive, but it's hard to forget that only 259 bars of it are genuine Beethoven.
Then again, I have another recording where the work is played exactly as written - but then you are left in mid-air. Which is worse?
Regarding the slow movement of this partially lost concerto, either of the two well-known romances for violin and orchestra would be in an appropriate key but are not considered to be stylistically compatible.

Talking about incomplete works, the first movement of the quintet in E flat major for three horns, oboe and bassoon, Hess 19, is an example of a very good reconstruction. In this case, the development section and the recapitulation were left intact and, from that, the exposition could be supplied with quite a reasonable amount of accuracy. It's a pity that the same two sections were not left in WoO5.

[Peter]

Whether the concerto ever was completed or not is an open question. The fact that the score has been completely written out, i.e. including most of the phrasing and the dynamics, and ends at the right hand side of a left (i.e. a verso) page, strongly points to a once complete score, at least one of a first movement.

Sketches suggest that a slow mvt as well as a finale were conceived too.
There is not much to reconstruct or to edit in the surviving score of WoO 5 (e.g. published in an appendix to Schiedermaier's 1926 published Der junge Beethoven); the question is: how to continue this fragment, as the development section is nearly completely missing, as obviously is the coda.

The question really is why bother to reconstruct it at all? Firstly Beethoven obviously thought little of the work himself otherwise he would presumably have returned to it later for publication - he of course salvaged music from the Joseph II Cantata. Having heard a reconstruction of the first movement it is I think quite unmemorable and hardly merits comparison with the glorious D major concerto or even the early Eb piano concerto.

[Michael]

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Having heard a reconstruction of the first movement it is I think quite unmemorable and hardly merits comparison with the glorious D major concerto or even the early Eb piano concerto.

I would have to disagree with you there, Peter. Of course it doesn't compare to the D major, but I find it quite up to the standard of early Beethoven (around 1800 or so). I know it's hard to judge from a fragment but I really like what's there. Maybe you haven't heard a decent recording of it.

[Peter]

I would have to disagree with you there, Peter. Of course it doesn't compare to the D major, but I find it quite up to the standard of early Beethoven (around 1800 or so). I know it's hard to judge from a fragment but I really like what's there. Maybe you haven't heard a decent recording of it.

I don't mind a bit of disagreement!! I know some people like it but I think it is thematically weak and unmemorable, not at all up to the standard of the Op.9 trios, the first 2 piano concertos or the early sonatas. If Beethoven had rated it highly himself (and assuming it was completed) it would have been published as Op.1. The version I have is played by Marius Sima with Jena Philharmonic.

[Chris]

WoO 5 is a fragment, but it is a significant fragment, and I think it's worth recording and listening to. I don't see the point in trying to complete it, really, but I'm glad to have a recording of the fragment as it exists.

[Roehre]

....not at all up to the standard of the Op.9 trios, the first 2 piano concertos or the early sonatas. If Beethoven had rated it highly himself (and assuming it was completed) it would have been published as Op.1. The version I have is played by Marius Sima with Jena Philharmonic.

WoO 5 stems from the Bonn years, and Beethoven did not take it with him to Vienna (contrary to e.g. the octet op.103, a composition from Bonn, but definitely later revised as the sketches for the revision are on paper from Viennese paper mills), as was also the case with the two 1790-cantatas, the piano trio in E-flat and other works.
It is even possible that the opus 40 Romance is based on material or even a movement for the Violin concerto, as the B-flat piano concerto (now opus 19) was also revised heavily between 1792 and its eventual publication, and the early sonatas are partly based on material from the three piano quartets WoO 36.
But opus 1, or 2 or 9, cannot simply be compared with WoO5 as these were conceived later, and even then much. Beethoven developed quite strongly between 1790 and 1800.

[Peter]

WoO 5 stems from the Bonn years, and Beethoven did not take it with him to Vienna (contrary to e.g. the octet op.103, a composition from Bonn, but definitely later revised as the sketches for the revision are on paper from Viennese paper mills), as was also the case with the two 1790-cantatas, the piano trio in E-flat and other works.
It is even possible that the opus 40 Romance is based on material or even a movement for the Violin concerto, as the B-flat piano concerto (now opus 19) was also revised heavily between 1792 and its eventual publication, and the early sonatas are partly based on material from the three piano quartets WoO 36.
But opus 1, or 2 or 9, cannot simply be compared with WoO5 as these were conceived later, and even then much. Beethoven developed quite strongly between 1790 and 1800.

Yes absolutely so why bother to 'complete' WoO5? If it didn't have the name Beethoven associated with it, nobody would bother! Incidentally the WoO36 quartets are really quite impressive.