google and a lot of patience to sift it all
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Today:
Berio:
Chambermusic (1953)
Sequenza VII (for oboe)
Continuo (1991)
de Leeuw:
String quartet no.2 (1964)
Khatchaturian:
Violin concerto (1940)
Prokofiev:
Violin concerto no.1 op.19
Szymanowski:
Violin concerto no.1 op.35
Van Gilse:
Nonet (1916)
Stockhausen:
Klang 17th Hour: Nedadon (R3 / Hear and Now)Comment
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And a lot of "free time", hey Roehre? It helps not having a "real job"! I'm just kidding you, my Welsh fiend (sorry, friend)! Nah, whenever I need to save time searching for CD/bibliographical resources I know where I need to come (as for example in my Bruckner request in another thread). Roehre certainly contributes to making this a true "reference" forum. I think we should pay him an honorarium (of which I take 25%, as I talent spotted him some years ago via another forum, and invited him here). So there.Originally posted by Roehre View PostComment
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Whilst my beef carbonade is gently cooking in the oven (I started preparing this at 10 a.m. this morning, sacré bleu!), here's what I've been listening to recently (the last couple of days, actually) :
Bruckner, Symphony No. 8, the "original" 1887 version (with Nowak score edition).
It's always a bit strange to hear a familiar work and then to hear it in a different version. It's very similar to listening to Beethoven's final version of the Op. 18 No. 1 quartet, and then hear the Amenda version. It throws up a whole host of questions, but on a purely subjective level boils down to : which do I prefer? Or can I appreciate both?
Well, for the Bruckner, I think I can say I prefer (slightly, or maybe a notch or two more) the second (1890) version in the first movement. I haven't made my mind up yet for the rest of the symphony.
Fellow Bruckner freaks Sorrano and Roehre will perhaps care to give their opinions.Comment
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Quick message to Roehre and Sorrano : I did try to find your recommendations for the Bruckner 8th, but I was impatient. I finally settled (because of quick "delivery" via internet) for the National Symphony Orchestra of Ireland / Georg Tintner.Comment
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Sorry, I wanted to say that I opted for the Tintner CD because I was in a hurry to get a CD recording of the "original" 1887 version. I'm not so worried for anyone's opinion regarding any so-called definitive recording version of the 1890 score (be that Haas or Nowak), because now I have the 1887 ("original", pre-Levi opinion) score I can make my own mind up.Comment
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Bruckner 8th, Scherzo. Some on this forum complain about the Sterbas introducing sex into discourse on music. I've never read any work by them, but sex has always been (and always will be) in music. Knock-out Scherzo by Anton !! Check it out!!Comment
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No the complaint was about ludicrous theories from the Sterbas such as Beethoven unconsciously acting as his nephew's 'mother'. As to sex in CM, well it depends what you mean - yes it can be exciting but that isn't quite the same thing! There are few moments in CM that I would describe in such terms, but the Liebestod is one. As to all the silly descriptions such as 'feminine endings' etc.. well I'm surprised the PC brigade haven't stopped that!Originally posted by Philip View Post'Man know thyself'Comment
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The 'reference' part of our site name applies to the main site where you will find plenty of Beethoven reference material. Roehre is of course a very welcome and knowledgeable member of this forum - so thanks to both of you! Listening earlier to Glazunov's 7th symphony which I liked better than the others and Elgar's 'The music-makers'.Originally posted by Philip View Post'Man know thyself'Comment
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Re the Sterbas : noted. Re sex and music : well, "exciting" if you prefer. Perhaps I really meant a more blanket term such as "sensual" (the sheer physical pleasure of engaging with music, whether as player or listener). In any case, your typical Brucknerian end-of-movement (usually 1st and 4th) peroration (the massive build up to final "tonic relief" [ouch/oops]) is pretty close to my definition of sexual-sonic gratification. And yes, the same applies for me in the coda of the 1st movement of LvB's Ninth (among other works by the same). And this should all lead me back to the McClary thread elsewhere, which I intend to do a bit later.Comment
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But before I do that, I wanted to continue what I've been listening to now, and how this relates to a concrete example of HIP practice. I do apologise in advance that this concerns Bruckner, but the issue I hope to raise may (though with considerable extrapolation / imagination) be fruitfully applied to our dear Beethoven (and others, of course).Comment
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Yes I think sensual is a better term and I agree CM can be so - Tristan is a clear example. I'm glad the 1st movt 9th coda does it for you, but for me it has a primeval awesome majesty about it like a volcanic eruption, which isn't at all erotic to my mind, but then people can get aroused by the weirdest things! My problem with the Sterbas, Solomon, McClary etc is just this - they project their own thoughts and hang ups into the works of other people and in so doing reveal more about themselves than their subject. I look forward to your returning to the issue later on.Originally posted by Philip View Post'Man know thyself'Comment
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Oh yes, you can count on it. Before we do the "volcanic eruption" stuff, please allow me a brief foray into HIP practice.Originally posted by Peter View PostComment
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Anyway, to get to the HIP point. As you know, Bruckner has left us various revisions, to which is added an editorial layer (Nowak and Haas in general, Schalck and perhaps others less so). For the Bruckner Eighth, we may simplify it into three versions : the "original" 1887 which was pooh-poohed by Bruckner champion Lévi, which induced dear Anton to make certain revisions leading to the (now normally performed) 1890 version (be that Nowak or Haas, depending on the conductors' preference). OK, so far so good. I'll break the posting here, to avoid those awful 92-page long texts that Michael so abhors ...Comment
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Well, guess what, kiddies? Yes, we also have an 1892 (3rd version) score, whose authorship is perhaps a little vague, but what is of major importance here is that is bears extra markings (presumably by Bruckner) as to its performance.
An example : in classical music practice, the composer would note "blanket dynamics" for every player (Beethoven did this, so did Wolfgang, so did Papa, and so on). So, whatever the orchestral forces, the horns and trumpets were marked p, pp, f, ff, and so were the strings, and woodwinds. Clearly, one would normally tone down the brass section for reasons of balance, so whilst the score may well indicate fff across the board, the conductor knows very well to reduce that dynmaic for the brass section, if not the poor strings (expecially those weak, spindly violins) would get drowned out.Comment
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