Least favourite Beethoven works

[Quijote]

Vienna, circa 1804. Beethoven’s apartment. The gathered are there to celebrate the first public performance of his Triple Concerto.

Dramatic Personae
LvB : Himself;
Schindler : Roehrer;
Carl August Seidler (violinist in the employ of Archduke Rudy) : Chris;
Anton Kraft (‘cellist in the employ of Archduke Rudy) : Philip;
Archduke Rudy : Himself;
Igor (Beethoven’s man servant) : Peter;
Frau Schnapps (B’s housekeeper) : Bonn 1827 (in absentia);
Anton Bruckner (via time warp, worm hole / black hole thingy) : Sorrano;
The Dublin Times music critic and freeloader : Michael.

It begins …

Schindler : Congratulations, Master, on the first performance of your glorious Triple Concerto!
LvB : Shut up, fool. Get me some roast veal. And two bottles of claret. And I mean now.
Dublin Times critic : Herr Beethoven, what a piece! Such mastery!
LvB: Get up off the floor and stop licking my slippers, will you !!!
Igor : Your roast veal, Herr Beethoven.
LvB: Who the hell are you?
Igor : Your man servant, Herr Beethoven!
LvB : Your eyes are too close together. You’re fired, get out.
Archduke Rudy : Absolutely spiffing concerto, old chap! Did I play it right?
LvB : Hard to write something simpler, I’d say. You did OK. Where’s that fat ‘cellist Kraft?
Kraft : Master?
LvB : I hear you were less than happy with your solo part?
Kraft : Well Master, a couple of months ago I did play Herr Haydn’s 1st ‘cello concerto and I must say that …
LvB (lunges in rage at Kraft) : You’re dead meat …
Seidler (intervening) : Master, please, I beg you! Look, I have the receipts from the concert, 400 florins for you!
LvB : Harrumph! Should have been more. Besides I’ve got to give Ries his cut …
Dublin Times critic : Pardon me, Master?
LvB : Er, … nothing. And will you please stop talking to me on your knees! Anyway, who’s this strange looking little fellow you’ve brought with you?
Schindler : Master, this is Herr Anton Bruckner, symphonist!
Bruckner (trying to press a florin into B’s hand) : Master!
LvB (pocketing the florin) : Get up off the floor, man! You’re as bad as this Irish fellow!
Bruckner : I’ve brought some sketches of my 8th symphony for your perusal, Master!
LvB (taking the sketches in at a glance) : Hmm, not bad, but why are you so long winded?
Frau Schnapps : Enough of the talking already! Time for bed, Ludwig!
LvB (looking sheepish, not to say henpecked...) : Yes, dear.

Fin

[Quijote]

Ah but that's too easy a cop out! How can we say that Beethoven was in any way better a composer than frau Schnapps or Ries? I'm serious here because in previous debates you have stated that we can't. Following the logic of this argument we can no more claim the triple concerto theme as 'flacid' than we can the 'theme' of 4'33 - or am I misunderstanding your arguments?

I will let the sketch above speak on my behalf. What is the theme in Cage's 4'33"? You hum it, I'll play it ...

[Preston]

Here is sketch, ENJOY:

Philip- Himself
Beethoven- Himself

Philip: “I...”
Beethoven: “Shut up!”
Philip: “Believe...”
Beethoven: “Shut up and get-out...”
Philip: “Your theme...”
Beethoven: “SHUT UP!”
Philip: “Herr Beethoven if you could but only give me a second...”
Beethoven: “Shut up!”
Philip, speaks so quickly it is almost incomprehensible: “Your theme from the Triple Concerto...”
Beethoven: “...”
Philip: “Is flaccid...”
Herr Beethoven then jumps up out of his chair and throws Herr Philip out of his 2nd story window. As Philip is falling he hears Beethoven scream, “I said shut up!”

THE END

[Quijote]

I suppose imitation is a form of flattery. Well done, Preston. You know, a veil has been lifted, suddenly.
Here is a final sketch.
Vienna, The Black Swan, B's favourite drinking and dining dive ...

Dramatic Personae :

LvB : Himself
Anton Kraft (a fat bastard of a 'cellist, though it could equally be Bernard Romberg) : Philip
Frau Schlitz : A Viennese whore.

It begins ...

LvB : Had enough, Kraft?
Kraft / Romberg : Yeah, but I tried, you know ...
LvB : You did. Why did you bother?
Kraft : Can't say, old boy.
LvB : There you go. For a later time, perhaps?
Kraft : Perhaps. Who can say? Wish you had written a 'cello concerto, Louis.
LvB : Yeah, me too. Could have made me a fortune, there. C'est la vie, hey?
Kraft : Yeah. Adieu, Louis.
LvB : Adieu, my friend.
Frau Schlitz : You done, you two?
LvB / Kraft : Yeah.

Fin.

[Sorrano]

Preston, you need more references to food in your sketch.

Philip, long winded? Can't argue.

Peter, two can argue about the Triple Concerto all day and never come to a consensus. What is needed are criteria agreed upon by both parties to determine how one work stacks up against another. If the Triple Concerto were my favorite Beethoven work would I say that it is inferior to the 4th Piano Concerto?

[Peter]

Preston, you need more references to food in your sketch.

Philip, long winded? Can't argue.

Peter, two can argue about the Triple Concerto all day and never come to a consensus. What is needed are criteria agreed upon by both parties to determine how one work stacks up against another. If the Triple Concerto were my favorite Beethoven work would I say that it is inferior to the 4th Piano Concerto?

Well if you were impartial yes! I mean for example I prefer Elgar's Cockaigne overture to his symphonic study Falstaff but I recognise the latter is the greater work. You certainly can't measure the greatness of a work by what you like best - that is simply a measure of your own tastes, not the composers' talent.

[Ed C]

I try to avoid comparing one work as "better" than another - it's all just opinions based on certain personal criteria right? Is "4'33" better than the 9th Symphony? Depending on who you ask it could be argued either way.

I vote that whatever piece has the most notes wins .

(I actually like the Triple Cto more than the 4th Piano Cto but only by a hair....)

[Preston]

Preston, you need more references to food in your sketch.

Perhaps roast veal?