What are you listening to now?

[Roehre]

Sofar I listened today to the Preludes of Pfitzner's Palestrina, as well as his overture to Das Kätchen von Heilbronn.
Further Stochausen's Pole für 2 (1969/'70) and Berio's Naturale (1985), followed by Richard Strauss' preludes to Capriccio and Guntram.

[Quijote]

Bach chorale (n° 1, from the "371") : Aus meines Herzens Grunde. A banal melody, but with those great Bach harmonic "fingerprints" (rich in suspensions, accented and non-accented passing notes, the superb IIb7 cadential approaches and a rather unusual modulation to the sub-dominant in bar 13.

[Quijote]

Talking of Bach chorales and so on, a little quiz for the musicians on this forum :
As you know, in traditional harmonic practice the leading note should normally rise to the tonic (at least in V-I / V-VI progressions), and parallel / exposed fifths and octaves are forbidden.

In terms of Bach's harmonic practice, when can the leading note and parallel fifths rules be broken?

A further question : did Beethoven break these "rules" too?

Your answer deadline is Wednesday 19 November, 18.00h. Failure to comply means dismissal from my class.

[Quijote]

To help you answer the question, take your "O" and "A" level harmony text books (Kitson, Lovelock et al...). Be careful, what the traditional harmony treatises tell you is not always the case for Bach, a supreme "rule-breaker". As to Beethoven ...

So that you can consult your sources, I extend your deadline to Friday 22.00h.

[Michael]

Talking of Bach chorales and so on, a little quiz for the musicians on this forum :
As you know, in traditional harmonic practice the leading note should normally rise to the tonic (at least in V-I / V-VI progressions), and parallel / exposed fifths and octaves are forbidden.

In terms of Bach's harmonic practice, when can the leading note and parallel fifths rules be broken?

A further question : did Beethoven break these "rules" too?

Your answer deadline is Wednesday 19 November, 18.00h. Failure to comply means dismissal from my class.

I know that Beethoven did break the parallel fifths rule and, when it was pointed out to him, he spluttered and blustered and finally muttered: Well, I allow them, anyway".
I don't know when this happened or what the work was.
Come to think of it, I don't even know what parallel fifths are (unless I play two CDs of Opus 67 at the same time?)
But the anecdote is true, to the best of my knowledge.

[Michael]

Just listening to Beethoven's Opus 18 No. 4 in C minor.

[Michael]

Good God! Guess what I came across in the first movement of the above? Yes, you've got it - parallel fifths!!!
What a coincidence.......

[Quijote]

[...] Come to think of it, I don't even know what parallel fifths are (unless I play two CDs of Opus 67 at the same time?)

Good one, Michael. Actually, if you played B's 1st and 4th piano concertos at the same time you might get a few coincidences of parallel fifths, though I have never tried; Cage would have, I dare say.

Nah, parallel fifths in "traditional" 4-part harmonic practice means that no two parts (or "voices") may move in parallel with an interval of a fifth between them. An example : the top voice (let's say soprano or violin) plays D-E-F sharp; the lower part (let's say the bass or 'cello) plays G-A-B at the same time. This produces parallel fifths. It is "forbidden" as it "erodes" the independent counterpoint of the parts.

There are many more such "rules of grammar" in harmony, but I won't bore you with them now!

[Quijote]

Good God! Guess what I came across in the first movement of the above? Yes, you've got it - parallel fifths!!!
What a coincidence.......

Well, what a coincidence !! Thank you Ferdinand Ries (sorry, I mean Michael) for pointing this out to us.

[Peter]

Talking of Bach chorales and so on, a little quiz for the musicians on this forum :
As you know, in traditional harmonic practice the leading note should normally rise to the tonic (at least in V-I / V-VI progressions), and parallel / exposed fifths and octaves are forbidden.

In terms of Bach's harmonic practice, when can the leading note and parallel fifths rules be broken?

A further question : did Beethoven break these "rules" too?

Your answer deadline is Wednesday 19 November, 18.00h. Failure to comply means dismissal from my class.

I spot an error in this message - you might get a better response if it were given it's own subject and not swamped by all the counter melodies. The suspense of this is thrilling but I'd hate to anticipate the outcome, might be a bit dissonant.

[Quijote]

I spot an error in this message - you might get a better response if it were given it's own subject and not swamped by all the counter melodies. The suspense of this is thrilling but I'd hate to anticipate the outcome, might be a bit dissonant.

Please feel free to move it, Peter. As a Cagean, I like all this confusion!!

[Peter]

Please feel free to move it, Peter. As a Cagean, I like all this confusion!!

No you need to open a new thread - leave it if you're happy but your errors may be missed admist the Cagean cacophony!

[Peter]

Listening to Perlemutter playing Ravel's le Tombeau de Couperin which I'm also trying to learn.

[Chris]

Listening to some concert arias of Mozart today.

[Michael]

Good one, Michael. Actually, if you played B's 1st and 4th piano concertos at the same time you might get a few coincidences of parallel fifths, though I have never tried; Cage would have, I dare say.

Nah, parallel fifths in "traditional" 4-part harmonic practice means that no two parts (or "voices") may move in parallel with an interval of a fifth between them. An example : the top voice (let's say soprano or violin) plays D-E-F sharp; the lower part (let's say the bass or 'cello) plays G-A-B at the same time. This produces parallel fifths. It is "forbidden" as it "erodes" the independent counterpoint of the parts.

There are many more such "rules of grammar" in harmony, but I won't bore you with them now!

Sorry - bit of thread confusion here. See "Harmony Quiz".