Stop,Repair,Prepare

[Quijote]

Thank you Churnel. It's nice to have a bit of backup, at times.
A cursory search of websites led me to the following extract :

The official anthem of the European Union, heard at numerous political, cultural and public sporting events, is the 'Ode to Joy' melody from the last movement of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, a true 'empty signifier' that can stand for anything," begins noted theorist Slavoj Zizek in his essay for this well-designed artist's book in which the American and Cuban Conceptual artist collaborators Jennifer Allora and Guillermo Calzadilla present their reflections on this ubiquitous masterwork. Modified classical instruments, scribbled musical notations, Nazi concerts, historical Turkish musical groups, the pope, Communist propaganda and other archival images are used to great effect."

[Quijote]

And another extract related to the work Stop, Repair, Prepare :

Commonly known as the "Ode to Joy," this famous final chorus has long been invoked as a musical representation of human fraternity and universal brotherhood in contexts as ideologically disparate as the Chinese Cultural Revolution, Ian Smith's "White Supremacist Rhodesia", and the "Third Reich" among many others. Today it is the official anthem of the European Union(*). Expanding the notions of both a prepared-piano and a player piano, the performer must reach over the keyboard and resituate his/her fingering of the keys both upside down and backwards while at times physically mobilizing the instrument to trace a path through the gallery. This structurally incomplete version of the ode (the hole in the piano renders two full octaves inoperative) creates variations on the corporeal as well as sonic dimension of the player/instrument dynamic, the signature melody being played, and its pre-established connotations. With "Stop, Repair, Prepare", Allora & Calzadilla explore the fluid and organic relationships inherent in music, exposing the varied dynamics between composition and meaning, instrument and performance, while tracking the political and artistic sentiments involved in music's history.

End of quote.

There are quite a lot of deeper issues involved in this "mobile performance-installation" therefore, wouldn't you say? I even detect a homage to John Cage !!!

(*) B's "Ode to Joy" is indeed the official anthem of the European Union, though the article and other extracts posted above do not mention that the anthem is for the moment a wordless one, as EU members cannot agree on the text !

[Peter]

Another point : you find the idea (pushing a piano around etc etc ) ridiculous. Once again, I imagine you post such comments expecting to find consensus and validation of your position.

No I'm 'expressing myself'.

Well, don't look to me for that. Have you actually looked into what the artists are trying to "say" (whether or not it finally has any merit)?
Would your apoplexy have been so great had the artists chosen a theme by another composer?

I'd have thought my invitation to step forward would confirm you'd be the last person I'd expect to share my views. Yes I only responded to Michael's post because it has a Beethoven connection which Churnel seems to acknowledge as more significant than yourself. However I couldn't care if they walk round in circles for hours playing twinkle twinkle little star, it would still be a pointless act of vandalism to a beautiful historic Bechstein.

[Peter]

What exactly is ridiculous about the piece? If you actually read the article you would probably better understand it. I find this piece to really speak and to have a great political and social significance. Although some modern art may be unattainable, it still can be powerful. I mean, we ARE all talking about it right now. And, obviously, the music was chosen specifically; not because it is just a popular tune. Is anyone thinking?

I have read the article and I'm pleased it speaks to you. Perhaps you could explain further 'the great political and social significance' it has for you and why this is lacking in Beethoven's 9th symphony and needs this further illumination? I mean these issues are hardly new or original and does it need such blatantly simplistic and obvious methods to make people think?

[Maurice Colgan]

A rather pedestrian recital without the use of the piano pedals :-)

Reminds me of the stack of bricks exhibition in London decades ago.

How jubilant hod-carriers must have been back then. Knowing they were actually Artists!

http://irelandtoo.blogspot.com

[Quijote]

No I'm 'expressing myself'.

I'd have thought my invitation to step forward would confirm you'd be the last person I'd expect to share my views. Yes I only responded to Michael's post because it has a Beethoven connection which Churnel seems to acknowledge as more significant than yourself. However I couldn't care if they walk round in circles for hours playing twinkle twinkle little star, it would still be a pointless act of vandalism to a beautiful historic Bechstein.

Your are quite right, it was clear from your invitation. We know where we stand on such things.

Churnel acknowledged the significance of the "Ode to Joy" before I did. I assure you I fully intended to develop that aspect, but you were quicker at aiming 'a dig' at me before I had the chance.

Nevertheless, you and Michael (and now Maurice Colgan) are using the article as a vehicle for poking fun at contemporary art, rather than asking what the work is about, or trying to say. The mockery (which I regret to describe as philistine) only seems to disclaim the "Hands off Beethoven !" approach so favoured here.

And if you think about the "mobile performance installation" mentioned in the article, you will see that - lo and behold - we are back in the realm of politics again. Art, music and politics, we just can't keep 'em apart, hey-ho.

What really offends you? That a duo of conceptual artists appropriate a theme by Beethoven and use it for their own artistic ends, or is it really because they have cut a large hole in a Bechstein?

I would like to answer the question you asked Churnel, but it would be polite of me to let him speak first. I will, though, have a few things to say about it.

As to the "pointless vandalism" visited on a Bechstein, well, one must suffer for one's art. (Add icon thing)

[Quijote]

Peter, I believe you have changed the original post you made to Churnel this morning. Why does your post now not display the "Last edited by : Today at ... Reason : ..." message ?

RESPONSE FROM PETER: If I did I changed it soon after posting - you have the option when editing not to leave a reason - I usually choose not to simply because my thoughts have changed.

[Peter]

Your are quite right, it was clear from your invitation. We know where we stand on such things.

Churnel acknowledged the significance of the "Ode to Joy" before I did. I assure you I fully intended to develop that aspect, but you were quicker at aiming 'a dig' at me before I had the chance.

Nevertheless, you and Michael (and now Maurice Colgan) are using the article as a vehicle for poking fun at contemporary art, rather than asking what the work is about, or trying to say. The mockery (which I regret to describe as philistine) only seems to disclaim the "Hands off Beethoven !" approach so favoured here.

And if you think about the "mobile performance installation" mentioned in the article, you will see that - lo and behold - we are back in the realm of politics again. Art, music and politics, we just can't keep 'em apart, hey-ho.

What really offends you? That a duo of conceptual artists appropriate a theme by Beethoven and use it for their own artistic ends, or is it really because they have cut a large hole in a Bechstein?

I would like to answer the question you asked Churnel, but it would be polite of me to let him speak first. I will, though, have a few things to say about it.

As to the "pointless vandalism" visited on a Bechstein, well, one must suffer for one's art. (Add icon thing)

I really don't care what the thing claims to be about, I don't need a piano with a hole in it to think about political, social issues in relation to art but some people I accept have obviously been greatly enlightened by it. Perhaps we should be asking different questions - is it ok to vandalise a 1920's Bechstein when the 1920s just happened to be the finest era of piano production for German pianos? Are the issues raised by this really new or is this not just sensationalism posing as art?

[Quijote]

Vandalism? Some uneducated yobbo mindlessly destroying other people's property is what I term vandalism. Artists in collaboration with the person who owns the instrument for mutually agreed artistic ends is not an act of vandalism. Why are you using such emotive, demagogic terms?

[Peter]

Vandalism? Some uneducated yobbo mindlessly destroying other people's property is what I term vandalism. Artists in collaboration with the person who owns the instrument for mutually agreed artistic ends is not an act of vandalism. Why are you using such emotive, demagogic terms?

Well what you and I term art and artists is best left out, but I hope you don't own a Stradivarius!

The trouble is that throughout its history the 9th has been abused for political ends - everyone seeing different things in it to suit their own ends and ignoring the somewhat idealistic and utopian message Beethoven and Schiller intended. To me that issue is of far more importance as well as relevance to this forum.

[Maurice Colgan]

I have nothing against good contempory Art, Philip. Your sweeping statements expose your immaturity.

I have created quite a lot of contemporary art meself. :-) (more than 700 paintings, wood carving and ceramic items, along with concrete sculpture) Yes, little ol' Philistine me. :-)

http://irelandtoo.blogspot.com

[Quijote]

Peter, I believe you have changed the original post you made to Churnel this morning. Why does your post now not display the "Last edited by : Today at ... Reason : ..." message ?

RESPONSE FROM PETER: If I did I changed it soon after posting - you have the option when editing not to leave a reason - I usually choose not to simply because my thoughts have changed.

Yes, but why does your post (which I believe you changed several hours after) not say at the bottom : "Last edited by ...". Of course, one has the option of not giving a reason, but members following on from an original posting may have the import of their response somewhat undermined if you later edit and do not acknowledge the fact.


RESPONSE FROM PETER: Philip it isn't an issue to discuss in this forum as it interrupts the thread, you can use the general forum or private message but really we are all allowed to edit our posts as we wish. Often I edit my own spelling mistakes and typos - there you've extracted a confession and I've edited this at least 3 times!

[Quijote]

Well what you and I term art and artists is best left out, but I hope you don't own a Stradivarius!

No, not a "Strad", just a humble "Mittenwald" 'cello, but still quite expensive!

The trouble is that throughout its history the 9th has been abused for political ends - everyone seeing different things in it to suit their own ends and ignoring the somewhat idealistic and utopian message Beethoven and Schiller intended. To me that issue is of far more importance as well as relevance to this forum.

This is, at last, an honest engagement with the issues raised by the work in question, and is to be preferred to simple mockery. You must excuse me, I have to prepare dinner for my daughter, but I assure you I'll return to the subject tonight.

Just before I prepare said meal, I would like to ask where Michael is, or is this just another of his "post-and-run" contributions? Michael : what is your position exactly? Remember, we had some confusion before with your posting about the rap fan on another thread. (Well, I might as well kill two birds with one stone. As to Maurice Colgan's comment, I'll put the poor creature out of its misery later.)

[Michael]

Just before I prepare said meal, I would like to ask where Michael is, or is this just another of his "post-and-run" contributions?

Philip, as you have so often stated, there is an art in reading text. Maybe you need some instruction in that art? Read the very first line of this thread and you will find my views on this subject. And this is my last word on this subject. Now, I must run ......

[Maurice Colgan]

"As to Maurice Colgan's comment, I'll put the poor creature out of its misery later.)" Philip.

Many have tried. :-)

http://irelandtoo.blogspot.com