A live video wish

[Chaszz]

If you could have a video of a live performance, premiere or not, from the 18th or 19th century, which would it be and why? Of course it would also include background interviews with the composer, conductor, performer, et al.

A non-public performance, such as a private gathering, is eligible, as is a composer or performer playing or creating in solitude in his study. But since so many would choose the Ninth Symphony premiere, that one is out of bounds!

[lvbfanatic]

If you could have a video of a live performance, premiere or not, from the 18th or 19th century, which would it be and why?

It would have to be that very famous concert of Thursday 22 December 1808 in which Beethoven introduced the world to the 4th piano concerto, the Mass in C, the 5th and 6th Symphonies, and for the sake of amusement that unbelievable Choral Fantasia.

These works have excited and animated countless generations of audiophiles, music critics, music scholars, musicians, conductors. And yet, when that world premiere of all these works took place, the theatre was cold (the owners having shut down the heat before the holidays), the audience complained mercilessly of the concert length, the sponsor had to hurry and find food for the restlessly uncomfortable crowd in that venue, and Beethoven apparently had to restart the 4th piano concerto several times because he and the orchestra were in anyhing but synch... and according to much heralded rumours, Beethoven lost his famous temper!!

WOW!!! What an experience that would have been for posterity had it it been recorded.

I found this link related to contemporary stories of that concert.

http://www.aam.co.uk/index.htm

[Gurn Blanston]

Well, I shall be the one who doesn't choose one of the many Beethoven performances, as dearly as I would take any of them.

This, from Michael Kelly, noted singer and friend of Mozart:

(not a quote from his "Reminiscences", just a paraphrase from memory)

I attended a quartet party last night at the apartment of a friend. They played some quartets of Mozart, dedicated to Haydn. The players were rather average, but there was a good deal of science among them:

Violins: Haydn and Dittersdorf
Viola: Mozart
Cello: Vanhal


OK, well time will not reverse itself and allow me to perch on the sofa alongside Kelly, but a video, now, there's a concept!

[HaydnFan]

I agree with Gurn, that sounds like an excellent evening!

Also, any of the evenings spent with Schubert and his friends to hear some of the composer's new lieder or chamber works would be nice also.

[Preston]

It would have to be that very famous concert of Thursday 22 December 1808 in which Beethoven introduced the world to the 4th piano concerto, the Mass in C, the 5th and 6th Symphonies, and for the sake of amusement that unbelievable Choral Fantasia.

These works have excited and animated countless generations of audiophiles, music critics, music scholars, musicians, conductors. And yet, when that world premiere of all these works took place, the theatre was cold (the owners having shut down the heat before the holidays), the audience complained mercilessly of the concert length, the sponsor had to hurry and find food for the restlessly uncomfortable crowd in that venue, and Beethoven apparently had to restart the 4th piano concerto several times because he and the orchestra were in anyhing but synch... and according to much heralded rumours, Beethoven lost his famous temper!!

WOW!!! What an experience that would have been for posterity had it it been recorded.

I found this link related to contemporary stories of that concert.

http://www.aam.co.uk/index.htm

Yes, that would be amazing. To see and hear Beethoven play the piano and to see him conduct.

That was an excellent choice lvbfanatic.

[Peter]

Well I suppose it would have to be that mammoth concert of 22nd Dec 1808 with so many first performances - including 5th and 6th symphonies, 4th piano concerto. Having attended a rerun of this event in Vienna a few years back in the same theatre was as close as I'll come to a video!

[Chaszz]

I have two wishes.

1. Improvisation is now all but a lost art in classical music, and there are many reports from contemporaries of lengthy, rhapsodic improvisations by the great composers. I would eschew the compositions we know and prefer to hear an improvisation we don't know, by Beethoven during his peak salon days, when he sent his small audiences into ecstasies with his improvising at the piano.

2. A description of Bach playing and conducting a keyboard concerto says his hands and feet were flying over the keyboards and pedals while he somehow vigorously conducted at the same time. This would be great to see and hear.

(And I could verify with my own eyes, did men really wear those wigs, frippery clothes and stockings!?)

[susanwen]

A provocative question! For sure I'd like to be there at one of Beethoven's performances introducing a new symphony; especially the Fifth, the Seventh, or the Ninth.

I'd like to see a performance of the ballet "Creatures of Prometheus." I'm amazed, amazed! that nobody thinks to stage it today.

I'd love to have been at the abortive opening of Stravinsky's "Rite of Spring."

So a corollary question: what was the greatest concert you ever attended?

I had the very great pleasure of attending nearly all of Rostropovich's Shostakovich cycle at Kennedy Center in Washington, and each was a life highlight for me.

[Rutradelusasa]

I have to agree about the mammoth concerto of the 5th and 6th symps. Most interesting should have been also the improvisational part of it, with Beethoven extending the already long hours of performance. It would have to be at least a 3-dvd set, with multi-angle cameras so we can view Beethoven up-front, his fingers and the whole ensemble.

I always find amusement in quoting <forgot the name and I'm in a hurry>, who said that he and his wife asked countless times for Beethoven to play something and he always refused, but one day he was so happy (about the new text for Florestan's aria) that he sat at their piano and played and played and that he <whose name I forgot and don't care to look up now> wished he had some magical way of preserving that moment
Why didn't he pull out his memory-stick-thingy-that-also-records-voice-from-sony??

[Peter]

I have to agree about the mammoth concerto of the 5th and 6th symps. Most interesting should have been also the improvisational part of it, with Beethoven extending the already long hours of performance. It would have to be at least a 3-dvd set, with multi-angle cameras so we can view Beethoven up-front, his fingers and the whole ensemble.

At the 2003 reconstruction of this famous concert in the Theater an der Wien they asked members of the audience to write down a theme during the interval. Bernard and I waited anxiously in the bar but alas my moment of glory wasn't to be! The pianist Robert Levin selected several themes suggested by the audience and provided a brilliant demonstration (in the style of Beethoven) of the lost art of improvisation. Perhaps the nearest we can come to Beethoven's improvisational powers is his Op.77 fantasy.

[Chaszz]

At the 2003 reconstruction of this famous concert in the Theater an der Wien they asked members of the audience to write down a theme during the interval. Bernard and I waited anxiously in the bar but alas my moment of glory wasn't to be! The pianist Robert Levin selected several themes suggested by the audience and provided a brilliant demonstration (in the style of Beethoven) of the lost art of improvisation. Perhaps the nearest we can come to Beethoven's improvisational powers is his Op.77 fantasy.

It almost goes without saying that improvisation is a lost art only in classical music, not in jazz, rock and fusion. It's interesting how jazz came along to give new impetus to improvisation at just about the same time it was becoming moribund in the classical world, the early 20th century.

[Peter]

It almost goes without saying that improvisation is a lost art only in classical music, not in jazz, rock and fusion. It's interesting how jazz came along to give new impetus to improvisation at just about the same time it was becoming moribund in the classical world, the early 20th century.

Perhaps it is also because the tradition of the composer/performer in classical music has gone. Mozart, Beethoven, Chopin, Mendelssohn, Brahms, Liszt, Saint-Saens, Bartok, Prokofiev all wrote their concertos with themselves as soloist in mind. Another factor is possibly recording which puts a distance between audience and composer.

[Raptured]

If you could have a video of a live performance, premiere or not, from the 18th or 19th century, which would it be and why? Of course it would also include background interviews with the composer, conductor, performer, et al. [...] is eligible, as is a composer or performer playing or creating in solitude in his study. But since so many would choose the Ninth Symphony premiere, that one is out of bounds!

Great idea! So many choices! Well, I can imagine the Beethoven´s DVD extras, of any of his works. I´d specially love the improvisations at small gatherings and the researsals. And special features about the instruments they used. Interviewing people of his time would also be priceless, we would find out so much about their estetic sense. And the editors that worked with LvB. But who would dare interview The Maestro??

I´d like also a DVD on the much loved/hated Symphonie Fantastique and Berlioz talking about it.

And I agree with Chaszz, who´d like to see a DVD on Bach. Is also a great curiosity of mine.

[ruudp]

well...at the risk of sounding arrogant..but I improvise a lot...in the classical style *atleast I think*...it's not that hard..just sit behind the piano...and play whatever comes to your mind..

[Gurn Blanston]

Great idea! So many choices! Well, I can imagine the

And I agree with Chaszz, who´d like to see a DVD on Bach. Is also a great curiosity of mine.

I'm fairly sure that technology, being what it is, would have Bach only on Betamax, or at best, on VHS...