Beethoven and Schubert

[HaydnFan]

I have read somewhere that "Beethoven acknowledged Schubert's genius"...is this true? If so, what were the circumstances because as far as I know, the two never met.

Also, is it true that Schubert participated in Beethoven's funeral? If so, in what capacity?

[Hofrat]

Originally posted by HaydnFan:
I have read somewhere that "Beethoven acknowledged Schubert's genius"...is this true? If so, what were the circumstances because as far as I know, the two never met.

Also, is it true that Schubert participated in Beethoven's funeral? If so, in what capacity?

Dear HaydnFan;

Schubert was a torch bearer at Beethoven's funeral.


Hofrat

[Hofrat]

Originally posted by HaydnFan:
I have read somewhere that "Beethoven acknowledged Schubert's genius"...is this true? If so, what were the circumstances because as far as I know, the two never met.

Also, is it true that Schubert participated in Beethoven's funeral? If so, in what capacity?

Dear HaydnFan;

If I am not mistaken, Beethoven was shown some of Schubert's songs. Beethoven remarked that Schubert had a "devine spark" (or something like that).

Hofrat

[HaydnFan]

Thank you Hofrat, very informative!

[Cetto von Cronstorff]

Originally posted by Hofrat:

Dear HaydnFan;

If I am not mistaken, Beethoven was shown some of Schubert's songs. Beethoven remarked that Schubert had a "devine spark" (or something like that).

Hofrat

This story has never been proven. It's very likely to be a nice posthumous fabrication. Schubert dedicated his op. 10 to Beethoven and they probably met each other now and then at Haslinger's shop in the Paternostergassel.

[Joy]

Schubert declared himself Beethoven’s “worshipper and admirer” but remained always too shy to approach him, even though the older composer held him in high regard: “Truly, there is in Schubert a divine spark…he will cause a stir in the world.” If they met at all, it was at Beethoven’s deathbed?! I've heard this story.

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'Truth and beauty joined'

[PDG]

Just as there is no concrete evidence that Beethoven and Mozart ever met, so it is with the case of Beethoven and Schubert. In this latter case I would put this down to Schubert's hero worship and shyness rather than a lack of opportunity. Imagine two such enormous musical minds in the same tavern at the same time, separated only by some drunken laughter, cigar smoke and a few busty wenches.....(and shyness ?).....

[melvyn]

Originally posted by PDG:
Imagine two such enormous musical minds in the same tavern at the same time, separated only by some drunken laughter, cigar smoke and a few busty wenches.....(and shyness ?).....

You conjure up a nice scene

[Peter]

Originally posted by PDG:
Just as there is no concrete evidence that Beethoven and Mozart ever met, so it is with the case of Beethoven and Schubert. In this latter case I would put this down to Schubert's hero worship and shyness rather than a lack of opportunity. Imagine two such enormous musical minds in the same tavern at the same time, separated only by some drunken laughter, cigar smoke and a few busty wenches.....(and shyness ?).....

If Schindler is to be believed we do have a definite meeting for Schubert and Beethoven - 19th March 1827. Beethoven on his deathbed was visited by Schubert in the company of the Huttenbrenner brothers and other friends. This was however denied by Spaun.

Friedrich Rochlitz however claimed they met in the summer of 1822, the year Schubert dedicated his duet variations to Beethoven.

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'Man know thyself'

[This message has been edited by Peter (edited 11-07-2006).]

[waldstein]

Originally posted by HaydnFan:
I have read somewhere that "Beethoven acknowledged Schubert's genius"...is this true? If so, what were the circumstances because as far as I know, the two never met.

Also, is it true that Schubert participated in Beethoven's funeral? If so, in what capacity?

you'll find lots of answers here :http://raptusassociation.org/schubertpages_e.html

[Cetto von Cronstorff]

Originally posted by waldstein:
you'll find lots of answers here :http://raptusassociation.org/schubertpages_e.html

There you will find nonsensical information such as:

'Schubert meets Franz Vogl'
'Contact with Viennese student circles. With his friend Senn, he is under police surveillance.'
'Schuberts illness beings. He returns to live in his parents' home.'
' 1826 His application for the post of Hofkapellmeister is rejected.'
'only public concert, [...] ignored by the press.'

Furthermore you will not be informed of an entry in Schubert's diary which is highly critical of Beethoven's music.

[Sorrano]

Originally posted by Cetto von Cronstorff:
There you will find nonsensical information such as:

'Schubert meets Franz Vogl'
'Contact with Viennese student circles. With his friend Senn, he is under police surveillance.'
'Schuberts illness beings. He returns to live in his parents' home.'
' 1826 His application for the post of Hofkapellmeister is rejected.'
'only public concert, [...] ignored by the press.'

Furthermore you will not be informed of an entry in Schubert's diary which is highly critical of Beethoven's music.

You refer to these phrases as "nonsensical information". Why?

[Joy]

I also read somewhere that Schubert once saw Beethoven from afar but was to shy to go up to him and talk.

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'Truth and beauty joined'

[Cetto von Cronstorff]

Originally posted by Sorrano:
You refer to these phrases as "nonsensical information". Why?

Every single one of them is false.

[Hofrat]

Originally posted by Cetto von Cronstorff:
There you will find nonsensical information such as:

"1826 Schubert's application for the post of Hofkapellmeister is rejected."

Dear Cetto;

Schubert was not the only composer who applied for the post of the Vienna Hofkapellmeister around 1826. Beethoven also applied, and like Schubert was rejected.


Hofrat