'Temperament', by Stuart Isacoff

[robert newman]

Dear Euan,

I was talking to someone not long ago on a page of manuscript from 1784 in Mozart's own hand containing incipits of various works officially said to have been composed by him nearly 5 years later. And of various works by Michael Haydn (or, at least, not by Mozart) which stubbornly remain part of the main catalogue of Mozart's compositions. If I were to make a list of such anomalies I don't suppose anything would change - we would still love this music. That such things can be acknowledged individually and piled on top of one another without ever disturbing convention amazes me. But I think it teaches me something valuable - that geniuses of the sort that 'Mozart' represent are holograms which can survive virtually intact despite their absurdities.

I'm glad this body of work has at least the name of one person, since I love it as dearly now as ever.

Thanks for your goodwishes. I have no 'axe to grind' against Mozart Forum or any student of music and its history. And thanks for this exchange.

Robert


[This message has been edited by robert newman (edited 06-01-2006).]

[Rod]

Originally posted by robert newman:


Thanks for your goodwishes. I have no 'axe to grind' against Mozart Forum or any student of music and its history. And thanks for this exchange.

Robert

It could be worse, I got ejected from the most prestigious Handel forum I cold find solely for suggesting that, currently, only period instrument performances of Handel on CD are worth listening to (well, also I said some uncomplementary things about certain well established sopranos).

These places tend to be pro-establishment and don't like any 'boat rocking'. When I first 'exploded' onto the Beethoven web scene I was regularly ridiculed for my opinions on period instruments, the piano in particular. On occasion I even got threating personal emails! Yet later I was offered the job of moderating that very same forum. It's the price you pay for being ahead of your time, let's see if time vindicates you regarding Mozart and Haydn.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin


[This message has been edited by Rod (edited 06-01-2006).]

[robert newman]

Hi Rod,

I agree more and more with your views on period instruments. I haven't heard a 'Fidelio' using period instruments but that would be fascinating if the orchestra was good. Have you ? Horns together must sound wonderful, for example. Or a period performance of the 7th symphony perhaps !!! Wow !

[Rod]

Originally posted by robert newman:

Hi Rod,

I agree more and more with your views on period instruments. I haven't heard a 'Fidelio' using period instruments but that would be fascinating if the orchestra was good. Have you ? Horns together must sound wonderful, for example. Or a period performance of the 7th symphony perhaps !!! Wow !

There isn't a period instrument recording of Fidelio. John Gardiner decided to record a pot-pourri version of Leonore with extracts from all three versions of the opera and the spoken dialogue replaced altogether by the most bizzare script delivered by a single narrator. And he had the ordacity to say this was better than Fidelio! I have bcome aware that Gardiner is losing his musical sanity with age. What is nearer the truth is that Gardiner probably doesn't have the balls to record the first authentic Fidelio.

Regarding the 7th, you already have the best authentic recording currently available. You can't beat the rasping sound of valveless French horns.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin


[This message has been edited by Rod (edited 06-02-2006).]

[Chaszz]

I've been on vacation in Paris for two weeks, just got home yesterday. Surprised to see this thread is still alive and kicking.

Just a few responses. Euan, if you were to read Isacoff, you would see that he does give a good rendition of the interplay between physics and music in history, and the central place that music played in the speculations of the great physicists like Galileo and Newton.

The second book which I mentioned earlier, on temperament, I have not read.

The other 18th C. temperament which was widespread was 'Well', which as I said before, was a compromise between 'Just' and 'Equal.' I would guess it might be very striking to hear in that it retained some of the impact of the acoustically perfect thirds, fourths and fifths which had to be respaced for 'Equal.'

Lastly, since Rod doesn't like any of the composers who lived during the era when the modern piano came into use, it is no surprise that he doesn't like the instrument itself. It would be more surprising if he did.

As to Paris, I had a wonderful time particularly with the works of Poussin at the Louvre. I have always loved this painter, but am getting more intimately acquainted with his work now, and am newly impressed with his greatness. The relationships among the forms of the figures and landscape elements in his paintings are very much like well-composed music, where everything follows everything else in an abstract, but powerfully emotional, logic.

And of course Paris itself was a wonderful experience in every way. Since my wife and I speak French passably, we possibly avoided some the indifference and ill will which the French are sometimes known to display towards the typical American tourist.

Oh, and Rod, congratulations on your wedding, which I am hearing about for the first time. I hope your wife has the fortitude to put up with your obsessions with Beethoven, Handel and Authentic Instrumentation forever. Best of luck.

Chaszz


[This message has been edited by Chaszz (edited 06-02-2006).]

[This message has been edited by Chaszz (edited 06-02-2006).]

[Rod]

Originally posted by Chaszz:

Oh, and Rod, congratulations on your wedding, which I am hearing about for the first time. I hope your wife has the fortitude to put up with your obsessions with Beethoven, Handel and Authentic Instrumentation forever. Best of luck.

Chaszz

Thanks Chaszz, to be honest if it wasn't for Beethoven I wouldn't be interested in the piano at all. My interest in the instrument is only to the degree that is serves Beethoven's music. After much trial and error I have come to the apparently bizzare conclusion that the pianos he used are the best for the job.

For the record Mrs C is a authentic convert without any arm twisting from myself and has a number of my recordings on her mp3 player. In particular she loves the recent magnificant recording of B's concerto No5 by Arthur Schoonderwoerd and the Cristofori Orchestra, also she loves Handel's unsurpassed Op6 concerti grossi by the Handel and Haydn Society/Hogwood.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

[robert newman]

Dear Chassz,

So you are a Francophile ! Me too. I simply love this country. My hope is to live there - as soon as possible. I've been there many times and love almost everything about it. Once lived there for almost a year. I specially love Charente, Dordogne, Aquitaine etc. and the area near Mt Blanc. Paris is great for a thousand reasons. What a country. Nature still in control and hugely interesting libraries and galleries. ! Everthing seems possible there. At least, to me. I WILL get there ! I MUST Two years from now - maximum !

I have a friend in Halifax Virginia who thinks the very same. France - Sanity !!! And there I could really get in to my music. But not here in England.

Robert

[Chaszz]

Originally posted by robert newman:

Dear Chassz,

So you are a Francophile ! Me too. I simply love this country. My hope is to live there - as soon as possible. I've been there many times and love almost everything about it. Once lived there for almost a year. I specially love Charente, Dordogne, Aquitaine etc. and the area near Mt Blanc. Paris is great for a thousand reasons. What a country. Nature still in control and hugely interesting libraries and galleries. ! Everthing seems possible there. At least, to me. I WILL get there ! I MUST Two years from now - maximum !

I have a friend in Halifax Virginia who thinks the very same. France - Sanity !!! And there I could really get in to my music. But not here in England.

Robert

Bon chance en votre ambition, Robert.

Should you achieve your ambition, would you kindly mind if I, my wife, our dog, cat, and some books and CDs, dropped in for a short visit of say, perhaps four to six months? We would be delighted to share your good fortune in finding such a nice abode.

Chaszz

[This message has been edited by Chaszz (edited 06-04-2006).]

[Chaszz]

Originally posted by Rod:

Thanks Chaszz, to be honest if it wasn't for Beethoven I wouldn't be interested in the piano at all. My interest in the instrument is only to the degree that is serves Beethoven's music. After much trial and error I have come to the apparently bizzare conclusion that the pianos he used are the best for the job.

For the record Mrs C is a authentic convert without any arm twisting from myself and has a number of my recordings on her mp3 player. In particular she loves the recent magnificant recording of B's concerto No5 by Arthur Schoonderwoerd and the Cristofori Orchestra, also she loves Handel's unsurpassed Op6 concerti grossi by the Handel and Haydn Society/Hogwood.

What a nice match between you that she loves these formidable B. and H. masterpeices, no doubt without any prompting at all from you. I celebrate your good fortune in finding such a copasetic mate.

Is there any chance that she loves a stray work, here or there, by an "unapproved" composer?

[robert newman]

'Bon chance en votre ambition, Robert. Should you achieve your ambition, would you kindly mind if I, my wife, our dog, cat, and some books and CDs, dropped in for a short visit of say, perhaps four to six months? We would be delighted to share your good fortune in finding such a nice abode''.

Definitely. Great idea. It's France or bust !
Seriously, I'm pulling out all the stops to achieve this. The friend (in Halifax, VA) works in Washington DC and like yourself we need no further convincing about the quality of life that France can offer. At the moment the area near Mt Blanc is of special interest. In 2 years.

Well, I'm like a fish out of water till I get there. Nothing fires me up more than it. It's so curious but when I'm there I just know it's where I have to be. Everything then becomes possible. I will work hard to make it happen. Will keep you posted.

Robert

[Rod]

Originally posted by Chaszz:

What a nice match between you that she loves these formidable B. and H. masterpeices, no doubt without any prompting at all from you. I celebrate your good fortune in finding such a copasetic mate.

Is there any chance that she loves a stray work, here or there, by an "unapproved" composer?

She's not a serious CM specialist, just the pop classics, she'd never heard of Op6 before she met me (there again it wasn't so long ago this music was new to me too). She has all kinds of other music on her mp3 player, from Frank Sinatra to Robbie Williams.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

[robert newman]

Just to let people know that I plan to be moving from England to the USA (Virginia) in late July this year. If all goes well hope to live there for around 2 years. And then France. Will still be keen to stay in touch with this forum.

Regards

Robert

[sjwenger]

Robert, please contact me off-list at swwenger@mail.com if you need local help or advice. I live in Maryland, not far from Virginia.

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To learn about "The Port-Wine Sea," my parody of Patrick O'Brian's wonderful Aubrey-Maturin series, please contact me at
susanwenger@yahoo.com

To learn about "The Better Baby" book, ways to increase a baby's intelligence, health, and potentials, please use the same address.

[sjwenger]

missed a key: that should be sjwenger@mail.com

[Joy]

Originally posted by robert newman:

Just to let people know that I plan to be moving from England to the USA (Virginia) in late July this year. If all goes well hope to live there for around 2 years. And then France. Will still be keen to stay in touch with this forum.

Regards

Robert

So you plan to be Americanized? Hope you enjoy your stay in our great states. You'll like Virginia I've been there many times and it's a beautiful state!



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'Truth and beauty joined'