Favorite Symphonies

[sjwenger]

I have a few different sets of the symphonies on CD, but my favorite is the Vienna Philharmonic, Sir Simon Rattle up. I also like the Herbert von Karajan on video. What say others?

Fate, banging on the door with a jackhammer

[Peter]

I've changed my mind many times over this and I'm certainly more inclined to HIP than I once was. I think it hard to select out a complete set because they all have their strengths and weaknesses. I've always liked Kleiber's 5th and Gunter Wand is another favourite. As for HIP, overall I go for Franz Bruggen. Jordi Savall's Eroica was an eye-opener - the detail was amazing but I feel now at the expense of power.

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'Man know thyself'

[Rod]

Originally posted by Peter:
... Jordi Savall's Eroica was an eye-opener - the detail was amazing but I feel now at the expense of power.

I suggest you turn your hi-fi up? Considering the accoustic conditions at the Eroica's first performance, the relatively small orchestra would have sounded louder than the BPO at, say, the Royal Festival Hall, I'm certain.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

[This message has been edited by Rod (edited 08-25-2005).]

[Peter]

Originally posted by Rod:
I suggest you turn your hi-fi up? Considering the accoustic contitions at the Eroica's first performance, the relatively small orchestra would have sounded louder than the BPO at, say, the Royal Festival Hall, I'm certain.

I thought you'd bite this one Rod!
When we consider that the 1804 private performance used 30 players and the 1808 56 players it is surely not a matter set in stone? Saval uses I think just over 40 players and whilst I love the clarity and approach to tempi I do think that this could have been enhanced with greater forces of around 60.

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'Man know thyself'

[Rod]

Originally posted by Peter:
I thought you'd bite this one Rod!
When we consider that the 1804 private performance used 30 players and the 1808 56 players it is surely not a matter set in stone? Saval uses I think just over 40 players and whilst I love the clarity and approach to tempi I do think that this could have been enhanced with greater forces of around 60.

And I'd knew you'd bite at the Schubert comment elsewhere!

Yes nothing is set in stone, it is a matter of acoustics. But the strings should not be allowed to swamp the sound. Also I was not totaly joking about turning your hi-fi up - when i heard the Academy of Ancient Music live the drums were much louder than what you usually hear on a recording, and this was in a relatively poor acoustic, so it will be 'authentic' to turn it up a little!

With Saval's CD the string section, though lean, is adequate within the acoustic setting of the recording through my hifi. But I don't listen to it at background music volume, whereby the sound becomes much less effective.


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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

[Rod]

Originally posted by Peter:
I thought you'd bite this one Rod!

PS have you heard the clip from the finale of the 5th Concerto (I provided the link elsewhere) with only one first and one second violin, as indicated in the score of the premiere!?

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

[lvbfanatic]

I recently had the opportunity to revisit the symphonies in the Arturo Toscanini repertoire.

Due to RCA's absolutely abonimable nearsighted approach to the recording of these masterpieces, the sound quality of these precious recordings was absolutely execrable.

However, due to the genius of the conductor the results vastly overcome the recording deficiencies.

Toscanini's approach to the works was fast paced but with an uncanny sense of breathing space. As opposed to the recently fast paced recordings which make it feel like you are desperately trying to catch the last bus to Liverpool.


Two particularly outstanding moments of the Toscanini approach are found in the 2nd movement of the 6th, and in the sudden appearance of Jan Peerce in the 4th movement of the 9th.

With regards to the 6th, Toscanini produced an absolutely sublime interpretation of the music. This is a movement which practically every other conductor has botched with excessive shmaltz and horrendously slow pacing, and up to Toscanini, had caused me to skip or at the very least fast forward.

As for the voice of Jan Peerce in the ninth... it dominates with an unprecendented clarity and articulation. Apparently, Toscanini had from the very first very much liked this tenor... and used him to absolute perfection in this symphony.

It's too bad that RCA never looked forward in its recordings with Toscanini...

After the Toscanini experience with these symphonies it has become very hard, if not impossible, for me to find any particularly satisfying interpretation of these masterworks of genius by any other conductor.




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A Calm Sea and A Prosperous Voyage

[Peter]

Originally posted by Rod:
PS have you heard the clip from the finale of the 5th Concerto (I provided the link elsewhere) with only one first and one second violin, as indicated in the score of the premiere!?

No I must have missed that, but doesn't it refer to the lighter accompaniment passages rather than full tutti?

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'Man know thyself'

[Sorrano]

lvbfanatic, are you referring to the remastered edition of the Toscanini? Those are vastly improved over the previous versions.

And I have to say ditto to what else you posted of the performances.

[Rod]

Originally posted by Peter:
No I must have missed that, but doesn't it refer to the lighter accompaniment passages rather than full tutti?

Go to: http://www.gyrix.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002036.html

It is French but look for the realplayer link.

In this recording there are only two violins total, giving the evidence in the notes which you can also find on the web (in English!) if you do a search.

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"If I were but of noble birth..." - Rod Corkin

[Peter]

Originally posted by Rod:
Go to: http://www.gyrix.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002036.html

It is French but look for the realplayer link.

In this recording there are only two violins total, giving the evidence in the notes which you can also find on the web (in English!) if you do a search.

Very interesting and enjoyable. The first edition though I believe was published only in instrumental parts in 1810. Breitkopf and Hartel didn't bring out an orchestral score until 1857.

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'Man know thyself'