Did Mozart suffer from Tourette's Syndrome?

[Chaszz]

This is an interesting article suggesting that Mozart's crudeness and odd behavior may have been due to Tourette's. It is written by a present day composer who has the illness. Warning: there are a number of scatalogical references, so you may want to avoid this if you're squeamish about such things.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/arts/main...ixartleft.html

[Haffner]

Interesting indeed but I wouldn't say that Tourette's can be found in his music. Mozart never really goes off in devilish directions, not in the way Beethoven did. He was very restrained by comparison. And also, "There's no residual misery. You always come away from Mozart feeling better.", I am forced to strongly disagree with this. What music is more immaculately miserable than the C minor Piano Concerto, the G minor Symphony K. 550, or, most of all, the Requiem? I feel sick each time I listen to it.

[Chaszz]

Originally posted by Haffner:
Interesting indeed but I wouldn't say that Tourette's can be found in his music. Mozart never really goes off in devilish directions, not in the way Beethoven did. He was very restrained by comparison...

The writer doesn't suggest at all that the syndrome can be found in the music. Quite the opposite, he suggests that Mozart was able to calm himself and transcend the illness only with the order, harmony and beauty of his music.



[This message has been edited by Chaszz (edited 10-15-2004).]

[Peter]

Originally posted by Chaszz:
The writer doesn't suggest at all that the syndrome can be found in the music. Quite the opposite, he suggests that Mozart was able to calm himself and transcend the illness only with the order, harmony and beauty of his music.

He does suggest this - "McConnel believes the root of Mozart's Tourette's is to be found in the music itself - something McConnel knows from his own experience of composing."


His interest in counterpoint and fugue - its unfashionable complexity - appealed to his Touretty side. The music for me has just so much happiness, for want of a better word. There's no residual misery. You always come away from Mozart feeling better."

I'm not certain about his theory, certainly with regard to the music, interesting as it is. I'll watch the program on Oct 18th and come back to this then.

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'Man know thyself'

[Hollywood]

This man's article on Mozart was discussed in both the Mozart Forum and another classical music forum that I post in. We all came to the same conclusion that Mozart having Tourette's was unfounded. There has never been any mention of this in any of the 14 books on Mozart's life that I have read. I think that this English composer who wrote this article just wanted his "fifteen minutes of fame" by saying that he thinks Mozart had Tourettes just like him. I would like to know where this guy got his information stating that Mozart had this disorder. As far as I know there has never been any medical evidence for this. This English guy probably wanted to compare himself to a famous composer who he thought (in his own mind) had personality traits and composed like he does.

I would be interested to know what the real Mozart experts have to say about Mozart having Tourettes. What would H.C. Robbins Landon say?

[Steppenwolf]

I read about this in the newspaper. Personally I am very sceptical. There seems to be a great need amongst many scholars in modern times to 'diagnose' traits of historical personalities, be those traits physical or mental. Perhaps if we 'diagnose' facets of an individual's personality it seems easier for us to understand. The complexity of character seems more comprehendable, by reference to some documented 'condition'. Thus we read all sorts of Freudian complexities in the mundane character traits of Caesar, Napolean, Beethoven, and so on.

If we encountered a person who told dirty jokes in real life, we would just put that down to the person having a smutty sense of humour. But if it is an historical personality then that is not good enough - there must be some 'clinical' reason for it. There must be some sort of 'condition' we can point to which explains it all.

What real evidence is there that Mozart had Tourette's Syndrome? He told jokes about poo, breaking wind, and, er, ... that's it. By that method of diagnosis I must in my lifetime have encountered thousands of Tourette's sufferers! Often the most simple explanation is the correct one. Perhaps he just had a dirty mind?!



[This message has been edited by Steppenwolf (edited 10-16-2004).]

[Peter]

Originally posted by Steppenwolf:
Often the most simple explanation is the correct one. Perhaps he just had a dirty mind?!

From the evidence of the letters, the entire Mozart family enjoyed these scatalogical jokes, perhaps they all had Tourettes! I think this is simply a cultural thing, the 18th century was a very down to earth age - coming from our perspective after a prudish 19th century we are perhaps shocked that a Mozart should use such coarse language, but on the other hand it shows he was human!

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'Man know thyself'

[Ludwig Amadeus]

What type of humor did Beethoven like? Has he often used coarse language?

[Sorrano]

Originally posted by Ludwig Amadeus:
What type of humor did Beethoven like? Has he often used coarse language?

I think in relationship to publishers and nobility he did.

[Michael]

Originally posted by Ludwig Amadeus:
What type of humor did Beethoven like? Has he often used coarse language?

I think his favourite type of humour was the pun - and the more atrocious the better! Unfortunately they don't translate too well, so unless you speak German, nearly all of the humour is lost.
As regards coarse language, as far as I know he used his share, especially when dealing with copyists or publishers, as Sorrano has said, but, in general, he was a lot more prudish than Mozart.

Michael

[This message has been edited by Michael (edited 10-17-2004).]

[Peter]

Well I watched the programme and remain unconvinced - McConnel was sincere in his beliefs but the main thrust of his argument that the music reveals evidence of Tourettes I found simplistic.

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'Man know thyself'