Signature

[chopithoven]

Does anyone know if the signature which says "L.V. Beethoven" that you can see in this link ( http://chopithoven.netfirms.com/lvb.jpg ) was really written by LVB, or by someone else? I think I've seen it in publications about the master, so it must be his. Also, do you know to which autograph page it belongs?

PS: Please copy and paste the URL of the link in your browser, otherwise it won't work.

[This message has been edited by chopithoven (edited December 25, 2003).]

[Peter]

I'm no handwriting expert but comparing it to other Beethoven signatures it looks authentic to me - Pre 1817, Beethoven signed his name on manuscripts in Gothic script, after that date he used Latin script. He also used his own variant to compound the problem, but in 1926 Max Unger transcribed Beethoven's form of every letter of the alphabet which has been invaluable to scholars in dechipering Beethoven's notorious handwriting! In proving authenticity types of ink, paper and watermarks also have to be taken into consideration.

Click on this link for an example of Beethoven's gothic script signature from an 1816 receipt - notice how the e's look like n's. www.kingsbarn.freeserve.co.uk/receiptsig.jpg


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'Man know thyself'



[This message has been edited by Peter (edited December 27, 2003).]

[Joy]

Very interesting. Do you know why he changed from Gothic to Latin after 1817? And do you have a picture of his latin signature to compare with the Gothic one?

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'Truth and beauty joined'

[Peter]

Originally posted by Joy:
Very interesting. Do you know why he changed from Gothic to Latin after 1817? And do you have a picture of his latin signature to compare with the Gothic one?

Chopithoven has provided a link to the Latin script signature and no I'm not sure why he changed, perhaps it was in some way connected to the legal proceedings over Karl? Anyhow, it was common at the time to use both scripts - gothic for German and Latin for French or Italian.


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'Man know thyself'

[Amalie]

Here is another of Beethoven's signature.
I love the drawing!
From the Roger Gross, Catalogue #49

http://www.rgrossmusicautograph.com/001-49.html

[Pastorali]

The signature I'm using on my homepage
http://www.beethoven.li/

I guess it's not authentic. Is it?

[chopithoven]

Originally posted by Peter:
I'm no handwriting expert but comparing it to other Beethoven signatures it looks authentic to me - Pre 1817, Beethoven signed his name on manuscripts in Gothic script, after that date he used Latin script. He also used his own variant to compound the problem, but in 1926 Max Unger transcribed Beethoven's form of every letter of the alphabet which has been invaluable to scholars in dechipering Beethoven's notorious handwriting! In proving authenticity types of ink, paper and watermarks also have to be taken into consideration.

Click on this link for an example of Beethoven's gothic script signature from an 1816 receipt - notice how the e's look like n's. www.kingsbarn.freeserve.co.uk/receiptsig.jpg

Thanks for the information. I found the signature in a website I don't remember, and neither do I remember if it had any information attached. I just wanted to know if the image I put as my desktop wallpaper was authentic. And indeed it appears to be so, in comparation with other signatures, such as the one posted by Amalie. Besides, it looks so spontaneous. Why would somebody want to imitate such a thing and post it in the web? Also, notice how B. makes the t's always alike: with a twirl upwards, then a twirl downwards, and then a twirl to the left.

PS: If you know any other website where I can find Beethoven signatures I'd thank the information.

[This message has been edited by chopithoven (edited December 28, 2003).]